[eHauler]

If you wanted the 180kW maximum range battery option at launch, read this email from Rivian:

Question: I selected the launch options so maybe I can still get it with the bigger battery but later?
Answer: “Currently, we are launching the R1S with our Long-Range Battery pack option which gets 300+ miles. Following production of the Long Range, we will introduce our Maximum Range 400+ battery option. This choice was made in order to get the most vehicles out to our community!
We want you to make the configuration choices that will best suit your lifestyle and future adventures. If you opt to wait for the Maximum Range battery, you can still configure the R1S and select your preferred battery pack at a later time.
Your configuration choices are not permanent and can be changed at any time in the future within your Rivian account. “

 

[Broker21]

This was pretty much expected! The big question is how long of wait and how much more!

 

[ZheFury]

Well it’s $10k more on the R1T and not available until 1/22, so you can probably expect about the same with R1S, if not longer.

 

[Yossarian]

Well it’s $10k more on the R1T and not available until 1/22, so you can probably expect about the same with R1S, if not longer.

I contacted Rivian about the availability date and cost for the R1S last week. The response was that there would be an "announcement" in January 2022 but there was no word on delivery or cost. Hopefully, the cost will not be more than it is for the R1T and delivery will not follow the same pattern with a 14 month wait, as is the case for the truck.

 

[ZheFury]

I contacted Rivian about the availability date and cost for the R1S last week. The response was that there would be an "announcement" in January 2022 but there was no word on delivery or cost. Hopefully, the cost will not be more than it is for the R1T and delivery will not follow the same pattern with a 14 month wait, as is the case for the truck.

Personally, I doubt the R1S will deliver a max battery pack before R1T, being as they’ve announced max packs for R1T in January 22. So you’re looking at 7 months from launch for max pack in R1T. If they’re not even announcing max for R1S until 1/22, it could be at least a couple more months before R1S with max pack deliveries begin. This is all purely speculation of course, but my guess is that since towing seems to be the main motivation for max packs, and R1S has a lower towing capacity, they’ll be dragging their feet on max packs for R1S as long as they’re selling all the large packs they can produce.

As for me, I don’t see myself paying a premium for max pack. The range on the large pack rivals my Tacoma TRD Pro on a full tank of gas, and the decrease in range when towing should be comparable with a light trailer. So, to me, the extra 10k and several month wait just doesn’t have the value.

 

[stevejack12]

I hate that they did it this way. The 400+ miles of range was really they key feature that made me comfortable with buying an electric pick-up. I've needed a replacement for my old Tacoma since I sold it in 2017. I've been driving my wife's old 2001 4Runner while I try to wait it out for the Rivian. I really need a replacement as soon as possible, however I am nervous about regretting going with the large pack battery. Everything I have read from owners of other electric vehicles makes it sound like you really can't count on getting the range promised by the manufacturer with everyday driving. I would be much more comfortable with my decision had they released the larger size first. Now I can't decide if I should get the launch edition I have configured or wait a few more months for the max pack.

 

[ZheFury]

I hate that they did it this way. The 400+ miles of range was really they key feature that made me comfortable with buying an electric pick-up. I've needed a replacement for my old Tacoma since I sold it in 2017. I've been driving my wife's old 2001 4Runner while I try to wait it out for the Rivian. I really need a replacement as soon as possible, however I am nervous about regretting going with the large pack battery. Everything I have read from owners of other electric vehicles makes it sound like you really can't count on getting the range promised by the manufacturer with everyday driving. I would be much more comfortable with my decision had they released the larger size first. Now I can't decide if I should get the launch edition I have configured or wait a few more months for the max pack.

I totally understand the range anxiety. Here’s how I’ve kind of made myself okay with the large pack (disclaimer: I’m not an engineer and I could be totally wrong. I just formed this argument based on personal experience and anecdotal evidence):

My Tacoma was getting about 16 on the highway and 15 in town with a 1.5 inch lift and ~33 inch tires. With a 21.1 gallon tank, that’s an absolute maximum of 337 miles of range. With a 10% safety margin, that’s right at 300 miles of range. We’re generally traveling with anywhere from 1-3 dogs which means fuel stops take ~15 minutes anyway for human and doggy potty breaks.

now let’s say on a road trip I’m starting with 100% on the large pack. Now, it’s advertised at 300+ which could mean 301-399. But let’s be conservative and say absolute max is 315. So with a 10% safety margin and erring on the conservative side, let’s say I’ve got 250 miles of useable range. I’ll do as much as 1000 miles in a day, but I really don’t like to. So let’s say I’m shooting for 500-700 mile travel days, and 30 minutes of charging gets me 200 miles. That’s only about 1-1.5 hours of charging for a full day of driving. I’m comfortable with that, and it forces me toget out and move a little bit more, and maybe rely a little less on caffeine for those long drives.

For daily driving, I have a fairly long commute: about 35 miles each way Even staying in the daily charging range of 10-80%, that’s 3 days of commuting on one charge. And since I work 24 hour shifts, that’s a week and a half of range for me, give or take a couple of days for normal errands. I also have a couple of other things going for me; 1, access to free level 2 charging in my neighborhood, and 2, enough solar to cover level 2 charging at home on my days off without tapping into the grid.

As far as towing goes, we plan on using that 10k saved on battery to buy a small teardrop camper, just big enough for sleeping. Everything I’ve read says that type of camper has a minimal effect on fuel economy and I’m going to just assume the same holds true for electric vehicles. So that shouldn’t really change the drive time all that much. Maybe an extra 30-60 minutes of charging depending on the length of the trip.

I know that’s a super long post, but I hope it helps somebody with their decision.

 

[stevejack12]

I totally understand the range anxiety. Here’s how I’ve kind of made myself okay with the large pack (disclaimer: I’m not an engineer and I could be totally wrong. I just formed this argument based on personal experience and anecdotal evidence):

My Tacoma was getting about 16 on the highway and 15 in town with a 1.5 inch lift and ~33 inch tires. With a 21.1 gallon tank, that’s an absolute maximum of 337 miles of range. With a 10% safety margin, that’s right at 300 miles of range. We’re generally traveling with anywhere from 1-3 dogs which means fuel stops take ~15 minutes anyway for human and doggy potty breaks.

now let’s say on a road trip I’m starting with 100% on the large pack. Now, it’s advertised at 300+ which could mean 301-399. But let’s be conservative and say absolute max is 315. So with a 10% safety margin and erring on the conservative side, let’s say I’ve got 250 miles of useable range. I’ll do as much as 1000 miles in a day, but I really don’t like to. So let’s say I’m shooting for 500-700 mile travel days, and 30 minutes of charging gets me 200 miles. That’s only about 1-1.5 hours of charging for a full day of driving. I’m comfortable with that, and it forces me toget out and move a little bit more, and maybe rely a little less on caffeine for those long drives.

For daily driving, I have a fairly long commute: about 35 miles each way Even staying in the daily charging range of 10-80%, that’s 3 days of commuting on one charge. And since I work 24 hour shifts, that’s a week and a half of range for me, give or take a couple of days for normal errands. I also have a couple of other things going for me; 1, access to free level 2 charging in my neighborhood, and 2, enough solar to cover level 2 charging at home on my days off without tapping into the grid.

As far as towing goes, we plan on using that 10k saved on battery to buy a small teardrop camper, just big enough for sleeping. Everything I’ve read says that type of camper has a minimal effect on fuel economy and I’m going to just assume the same holds true for electric vehicles. So that shouldn’t really change the drive time all that much. Maybe an extra 30-60 minutes of charging depending on the length of the trip.

I know that’s a super long post, but I hope it helps somebody with their decision.

I appreciate your response. I am trying to be ok with the 300+ miles. Part of my problem is that my family has a vacation home that I visit frequently. Its 340 miles away. I usually do this trip without stopping. While I wouldn't mind stopping sometimes. It would be nice to know that I still have the option to do it in one trip.

I'm curious when to actually expect my R1T. If my delivery is on the tail end of the launch editions and I don't receive it until the end of 2021 anyway. I think I would rather wait a couple more months at that point for the max pack. Hopefully, by the time I have to make that decision there will be some real world reviews of the truck by actual owners.

 

[eHauler]

I appreciate your response. I am trying to be ok with the 300+ miles. Part of my problem is that my family has a vacation home that I visit frequently. Its 340 miles away. I usually do this trip without stopping. While I wouldn't mind stopping sometimes. It would be nice to know that I still have the option to do it in one trip.

I'm curious when to actually expect my R1T. If my delivery is on the tail end of the launch editions and I don't receive it until the end of 2021 anyway. I think I would rather wait a couple more months at that point for the max pack. Hopefully, by the time I have to make that decision there will be some real world reviews of the truck by actual owners.

The best thing they can do with all that's going on is to make it easy for owners to switch. Fortunately Rivian support has been super responsive regardless how you try to reach them. So inquiring early on the max battery could help prepare. If anyone does be sure to share you response!

 

[Mr. Gee]

The range on the large pack rivals my Tacoma TRD Pro on a full tank of gas, and the decrease in range when towing should be comparable with a light trailer. So, to me, the extra 10k and several month wait just doesn’t have the value.

The ranges are under optimal conditions. Towing, uphill driving and cold weather will all take a toll on range in ways your Tacoma would not. It could end up being half the stated range depending on conditions.

 

[stevejack12]

The ranges are under optimal conditions. Towing, uphill driving and cold weather will all take a toll on range in ways your Tacoma would not. It could end up being half the stated range depending on conditions.

This is exactly why I'm leaning towards waiting for the Max pack. Still a hard decision.

 

[Yossarian]

Like some others, I plan to tow a teardrop with my Rivian, though in my case it's a larger boondock camper (close to 8' front exterior and about 2,300# laden). It's really difficult to determine the impact of the trailer on range, but I would expect at least a 20% reduction. Having a nominal 315 mile range would then mean a max range of about 250 miles while towing. Assuming an average starting charge of 90% and a 10% SoC at recharge means an effective range of just over 200 miles.

200 miles of range is enough much of the time - on interstates for example - but what about other occasions such as on old highways or state roads? One of the trips that I make regularly is Bozeman, MT to SLC, about 410 miles split roughly evenly between interstate and old US highway. Will there be a working charging station (or two) between Big Sky and Idaho Falls, a stretch of about 200 miles on US highways? Perhaps, but it would sure be nice to have another 80 or 100 miles of cushion.

The Rivian is supposed to be an adventure vehicle but without adequate range, much of the adventure could be finding charge points.

 

[Nellmack]

Like some others, I plan to tow a teardrop with my Rivian, though in my case it's a larger boondock camper (close to 8' front exterior and about 2,300# laden). It's really difficult to determine the impact of the trailer on range, but I would expect at least a 20% reduction. Having a nominal 315 mile range would then mean a max range of about 250 miles while towing. Assuming an average starting charge of 90% and a 10% SoC at recharge means an effective range of just over 200 miles.

200 miles of range is enough much of the time - on interstates for example - but what about other occasions such as on old highways or state roads? One of the trips that I make regularly is Bozeman, MT to SLC, about 410 miles split roughly evenly between interstate and old US highway. Will there be a working charging station (or two) between Big Sky and Idaho Falls, a stretch of about 200 miles on US highways? Perhaps, but it would sure be nice to have another 80 or 100 miles of cushion.

The Rivian is supposed to be an adventure vehicle but without adequate range, much of the adventure could be finding charge points.

I'm furious that the Max battery pack is not available! I'm thinking about pulling my order. I need a new truck and I've been waiting patiently. Adding another 6-8 months (which is another 12-14 months from now) is wrong and I believe it's a bad decision.

 

[Yossarian]

I'm furious that the Max battery pack is not available! I'm thinking about pulling my order. I need a new truck and I've been waiting patiently. Adding another 6-8 months (which is another 12-14 months from now) is wrong and I believe it's a bad decision.

I'm sure there's a reason other than marketing that the Max is only available on the R1T, and even then not until Jan 2022. I'm also sure that the delay in delivery for an R1S with the Max battery package will be on the order of 18 to 24 months from today, not just a year or so.

My guess is that 1) it is easier to integrate the Max battery pack on the truck, 2) the production engineering for the larger battery is not yet complete for either model (or the alternative production line is slated to come on line later in the production year) and/or 3) there are supply constraints and Rivian is not be able to procure enough of the larger battery packs to support both the R1T and R1S until sometime after 2022.

Rivian seems to be counting on demand for the 135kWh models to carry them through 2021, with a goal toward integrating limited Max battery production in 2022 for the R1T. The plan to only "announce" that the Max is available for the R1S in Jan '22 gives Rivian the cushion they must need to take the lessons learned from R1T Max production and apply them to the R1S Max alt line. So delivery of the R1S with the Max package would seem unlikely before the end of 2022, possibly not until 2023.

I hope I'm wrong andt with only a thousand dollars tied up, will take a wait and see approach. If I wind up needing a new car before 2023, it will be another ICE vehicle though.

 

[Mr. Gee]

Gotta be a supply issue. They can sell over 30% more vehicles at 135kWh as they can with the big battery if that's the bottleneck. So piss off 10/100/1000 people or piss off 13/130/1300 people?

 

[Yossarian]

Gotta be a supply issue. They can sell over 30% more vehicles at 135kWh as they can with the big battery if that's the bottleneck. So piss off 10/100/1000 people or piss off 13/130/1300 people?

Whatever the issue is, it's hugely disappointing, and there really is no good reason that Rivian wasn't forthcoming in making it clear that the delay for an R1S with a Max battery pack would be lengthy. Cost is at least as big a concern, particularly given Rivian's lack of candor on availability. The company was able to advertise the cost for the Max on the R1T ($10k) and that they haven't done so for the R1S almost certainly means that it will be more, perhaps a lot more.

The Tesla Model Y can easily tow my teardrop and already has 370 miles of range at a cost, with the towing package (4,960# max cap), of about $82,000. That's competitive with the R1S which be at least $87,500 with the Max but comes with a $7,500 Federal tax credit that could make the Rivian just under $80k. The real difference is that you can actually take delivery of the Tesla.

 

[Mr. Gee]

It's almost 2021, get used to the new normal. Startups play the PR angle to generate buzz and demand, and plenty never follow through. For now Rivian looks different and has a product, what it doesn't have is decades of manufacturing and distribution experience. I think there will be loads more frustration as we move forward because there are non-stop reports of advances in technology and Rivian likely won't have much of it incorporated (see, e.g., wireless charging) in their production models. So people receiving vehicles a year from now will gripe at the lack of "latest" features/technology. Especially with the upcoming releases of a slew of EV vehicles from Nissan, Audi, Ford, Fisker, Genesis, Tesla, Polestar and VW (and others).

 

[jfree66]

I feel the exact same way! After hearing for nearly two years that the higher end versions would be built first, they can spin it however they want, but not producing the largest and most expensive battery pack just doesn't jive with what we've been told to date. Combine that with RJ's recent interview comments about their supply chain being 'strained' for several years into the future, I'm beginning to second-guess my decision out of fear that current supplies could be used up with the launch editions, the R1Ss, and the Amazon delivery vans. Even with very limited details and information they've provided beyond tidbits here and there, this decision is very disappointing to me. I don't think this is a dishonesty issue, but a decision that changes their prior statements at the last minute, without telling anyone about it, and at a time that would not allow preorderers that planned on the max pack to give it some thought to determine if they could live with the 300 mile pack.
I REALLY want this truck, but my skepticism has been rising since the preorder configurator was launched on 11/16. Maybe I should have just gone with the cheaper 300 miler, but regardless, it's too late now since the launch editions are sold out. At minimum, Rivian should have announced this to preorderers a few days before the configurator went live to allow them to decide if they were comfortable waiting for even longer, with potential additional delays ahead, or 'settle' for the 300 mile pack so as to ensure they actually get it in their driveway someday in the foreseeable future. I have to decide if it's still worth waiting indefinitely...I struggle with 'unknowns' and patience...or just head to a dealer that can sell me a truck as soon as I write the check. Bummed...but still somewhat hopeful...
J

I hate that they did it this way. The 400+ miles of range was really they key feature that made me comfortable with buying an electric pick-up. I've needed a replacement for my old Tacoma since I sold it in 2017. I've been driving my wife's old 2001 4Runner while I try to wait it out for the Rivian. I really need a replacement as soon as possible, however I am nervous about regretting going with the large pack battery. Everything I have read from owners of other electric vehicles makes it sound like you really can't count on getting the range promised by the manufacturer with everyday driving. I would be much more comfortable with my decision had they released the larger size first. Now I can't decide if I should get the launch edition I have configured or wait a few more months for the max pack.

 

[Wildabeest]

I feel the exact same way! After hearing for nearly two years that the higher end versions would be built first, they can spin it however they want, but not producing the largest and most expensive battery pack just doesn't jive with what we've been told to date. Combine that with RJ's recent interview comments about their supply chain being 'strained' for several years into the future, I'm beginning to second-guess my decision out of fear that current supplies could be used up with the launch editions, the R1Ss, and the Amazon delivery vans. Even with very limited details and information they've provided beyond tidbits here and there, this decision is very disappointing to me. I don't think this is a dishonesty issue, but a decision that changes their prior statements at the last minute, without telling anyone about it, and at a time that would not allow preorderers that planned on the max pack to give it some thought to determine if they could live with the 300 mile pack.
I REALLY want this truck, but my skepticism has been rising since the preorder configurator was launched on 11/16. Maybe I should have just gone with the cheaper 300 miler, but regardless, it's too late now since the launch editions are sold out. At minimum, Rivian should have announced this to preorderers a few days before the configurator went live to allow them to decide if they were comfortable waiting for even longer, with potential additional delays ahead, or 'settle' for the 300 mile pack so as to ensure they actually get it in their driveway someday in the foreseeable future. I have to decide if it's still worth waiting indefinitely...I struggle with 'unknowns' and patience...or just head to a dealer that can sell me a truck as soon as I write the check. Bummed...but still somewhat hopeful...
J

I initially did my R1T configuration non-LE with the larger battery pack, but later went back and changed to LE after seeing comments from others on the forum. The reason I did that was the feedback from CS to several forum members (including myself) was that you could later switch out of the LE and still keep your place in line for a non-LE, but could not do the inverse. I’ve not yet decided which one I will actually get, but configuring the LE keeps my options open. Lots more information will be coming out over the next 6 months that will allow me to make a better informed final decision. I’m glad I changed my configuration so that I have the option to go either way.

 

[jfree66]

I initially did my R1T configuration non-LE with the larger battery pack, but later went back and changed to LE after seeing comments from others on the forum. The reason I did that was the feedback from CS to several forum members (including myself) was that you could later switch out of the LE and still keep your place in line for a non-LE, but could not do the inverse. I’ve not yet decided which one I will actually get, but configuring the LE keeps my options open. Lots more information will be coming out over the next 6 months that will allow me to make a better informed final decision. I’m glad I changed my configuration so that I have the option to go either way.

I don't think I'm understanding what you're saying; at least compared to what Rivian has told me. I also configured mine as an LE at first because the 400 mile option wasn't available with the LE. I switched it to the max pack, but how in the world would that keep my place in line? If they aren't producing any of the 400 mile pack vehicles until January 2022 at the earliest, are you implying that they'll go ahead and build you a 400 mile pack before that simply because you initially configured a launch edition? I know 'tone' doesn't always come off as intended...not trying to be a smart *ss here, so I hope it's not coming off that way. I just don't quite understand where you're going here with regard to thinking you'll keep a certain place in line that would be a certain date before the vehicle you want (assuming that's the max pack) is even (planned) to be built. Maybe it's me not making sense here...not sure.