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The rivian had snow rated tires, tundra didn’t. Tires are more important then anything in snow driving. Tundra was at a major disadvantage.

Also every video I’ve seen of the Rivian shows exactly what I was afraid of. Articulation sucks with the pointless air suspension.
 

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Also every video I’ve seen of the Rivian shows exactly what I was afraid of. Articulation sucks with the pointless air suspension.
I guess everything is a trade-off. Having a truck this capable off-road, that appears to actually drive more like a sports car than a pick-up truck "on-road" is likely driving this trade-off. Rivian did their homework on the US automobile segment and absolutely weighted their design more heavily toward the traditional truck & SUV user in the US market place...

i. e. The driver that never goes off-road.

"How well would these vehicles perform on-road" is probably just another way to think about this: Off-Road Basics: Axle Articulation - Got Flex?
 

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Most likely 99% of future Rivian drivers will never see the conditions that they ran the truck through in the video, so for the majority.. the R1T passed the drill with flying colors ;)
 

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I guess everything is a trade-off. Having a truck this capable off-road, that appears to actually drive more like a sports car than a pick-up truck "on-road" is likely driving this trade-off. Rivian did their homework on the US automobile segment and absolutely weighted their design more heavily toward the traditional truck & SUV user in the US market place...

i. e. The driver that never goes off-road.

"How well would these vehicles perform on-road" is probably just another way to think about this: Off-Road Basics: Axle Articulation - Got Flex?
I agree that very few drivers will ever take these things (or any truck/SUV) on more serious off road then a Car can handle. For me in Alaska I do off road my trucks fairly hard, and if I didn’t I wouldn’t own a truck. For those of you who don’t off road articulation is at least as important as ground clearance. The problem with air is that when you increase the height you increase the spring rate therefore decreasing articulation. Which is the opposite of what you want off roading. Most People that off road newer Jeep GCs pull the air suspension for springs or never put it in high position.
 

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Most likely 99% of future Rivian drivers will never see the conditions that they ran the truck through in the video, so for the majority.. the R1T passed the drill with flying colors ;)
For me I have a hard time understanding why they would own a truck then. A model 3/Y is a much better on-road vehicle.
 

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Some of the videos in this little snippet are pretty amazing. I will do a bit of "challenging" off-road and quite a few mountain passes & gaps with the R1T that get really interesting in the spring during freeze / thaw. Seeing these vids makes me think the R1T will be more than capable for what I need, while still providing a really plush on-road / dirt road experience: Rivian Is Not Messing Around With Its Off-Road Tests of the R1T
 

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For me I have a hard time understanding why they would own a truck then. A model 3/Y is a much better on-road vehicle.
Better by what standards? Some Rivian R1S buyers may want more interior space or more luxury. R1T buyers may want to haul dirt bikes, bicycles, lumber, or just have a cool camping rig w/ the kitchen and tent.
 

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Better by what standards? Some Rivian R1S buyers may want more interior space or more luxury. R1T buyers may want to haul dirt bikes, bicycles, lumber, or just have a cool camping rig w/ the kitchen and tent.
In a 4.5’ bed a full sized dirt bike will be a struggle Without a trailer or hitch rack considering full sized bikes are more like 6.5-7’ long. Lumber, see 4.5’ bed…. The f150 will be better as a hauling truck. Rivian went after the off road/overland crowd. In that uses 20” wheels are pointless and articulation in king.

The kitchen is really cool but will be used as a wow factor for tailgating but completely impractical for backcountry camping. Mostly due to the fact it is huge (you lose the gear tunnel) and insanely expensive $5k. A better camp kitchen set up is a REI roll table or even a plastic lifetime with a 2 burner Coleman. With my land cruiser I use a mountain summit roll top and two MSRs or a Coleman 2 burner duel fuel and a campfire. You can get a very nice and functional and versatile camp kitchen set up that isn’t dependent on being attached to your truck for $500.

I would think urban trucks sized like the Hundai Santa Cruze makes more sense for those that don’t use the off road capacity.

I’ll add though I’m very function over form for most vehicles I’ve bought (track Cars included).
 

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Lots of folks haul dirt bikes with the tailgate down, and the R1T has plenty of bed length this way. My old Ridgeline was my favorite dirt bike hauler I ever had, and it required the tailgate down to do so as well.
 

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In a 4.5’ bed a full sized dirt bike will be a struggle Without a trailer or hitch rack considering full sized bikes are more like 6.5-7’ long. Lumber, see 4.5’ bed…. The f150 will be better as a hauling truck. Rivian went after the off road/overland crowd. In that uses 20” wheels are pointless and articulation in king.

The kitchen is really cool but will be used as a wow factor for tailgating but completely impractical for backcountry camping. Mostly due to the fact it is huge (you lose the gear tunnel) and insanely expensive $5k. A better camp kitchen set up is a REI roll table or even a plastic lifetime with a 2 burner Coleman. With my land cruiser I use a mountain summit roll top and two MSRs or a Coleman 2 burner duel fuel and a campfire. You can get a very nice and functional and versatile camp kitchen set up that isn’t dependent on being attached to your truck for $500.
1. BED: The gooseneck hinge design that "kicks" the tailgate out further is a really smart design for the short bed. Definitely adds a good bit of extra length. We'll see how the hinge holes react to dirt, mulch or rocks falling in, BUT the flap between the bed and the tailgate seems well designed to prevent that... TBD

2. KITCHEN: 100% agreed. If you already have a Coleman or white fuel burning cook-top or jet-boil and a camp kitchen set, you can avoid the Camp Kitchen. That said if you don't have anything, I could see how the Camp Kitchen could be interesting since it draws off the battery and is so well integrated. You would still have the Frunk for storage (and under the tonneau if the bed was open). Personally, I am going to get the gear tunnel slide and rig a small camp table for it and use my Coleman when cooking.
 

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R1S Adventure ordered 10/27/2021), Red, Large battery (want Max, tho)
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For me I have a hard time understanding why they would own a truck then. A model 3/Y is a much better on-road vehicle.
The F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the US.

Not the best-selling truck - the best-selling vehicle. Do you think these are all being used for work/hauling/etc on any regular basis?

No. Americans like size & mass in their vehicles.

While you may have a hard time understanding why people who only need a car don't buy a car, it doesn't mean that's how it works in the real world.

Also, I doubt many Jeeps see anything more challenging than a gravel fire road.
 

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The F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the US.

Not the best-selling truck - the best-selling vehicle. Do you think these are all being used for work/hauling/etc on any regular basis?

No. Americans like size & mass in their vehicles.

While you may have a hard time understanding why people who only need a car don't buy a car, it doesn't mean that's how it works in the real world.

Also, I doubt many Jeeps see anything more challenging than a gravel fire road.
The point I was trying to make “The f150 will be better as a hauling truck.” Rivian isn’t going to beat Ford in this space. Why personally I was hoping Rivian would go more into the off road space with good suspension articulation and 17” (or at most 18”) rims.
 

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In a 4.5’ bed a full sized dirt bike will be a struggle Without a trailer or hitch rack considering full sized bikes are more like 6.5-7’ long. Lumber, see 4.5’ bed…. The f150 will be better as a hauling truck. Rivian went after the off road/overland crowd. In that uses 20” wheels are pointless and articulation in king.

The kitchen is really cool but will be used as a wow factor for tailgating but completely impractical for backcountry camping. Mostly due to the fact it is huge (you lose the gear tunnel) and insanely expensive $5k. A better camp kitchen set up is a REI roll table or even a plastic lifetime with a 2 burner Coleman. With my land cruiser I use a mountain summit roll top and two MSRs or a Coleman 2 burner duel fuel and a campfire. You can get a very nice and functional and versatile camp kitchen set up that isn’t dependent on being attached to your truck for $500.

I would think urban trucks sized like the Hundai Santa Cruze makes more sense for those that don’t use the off road capacity.

I’ll add though I’m very function over form for most vehicles I’ve bought (track Cars included).
I'm active in the MX world myself and worried a little about that (bed length). But, I believe the bed is 7' long with the tailgate down. I already have a "motogate" (net that prevents stuff from coming out of the bed) so it shouldn't be an issue.
 

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I'm active in the MX world myself and worried a little about that (bed length). But, I believe the bed is 7' long with the tailgate down. I already have a "motogate" (net that prevents stuff from coming out of the bed) so it shouldn't be an issue.
I've hauled dirt bikes countless times w/ both an Avalanche and a Ridgeline with the tailgate down but no "motogate" with no problems whatsoever. I just run a tiedown or taut bungee cord from the rearmost bed tiedown points around the rear wheel as an added safeguard.
 

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I agree that very few drivers will ever take these things (or any truck/SUV) on more serious off road then a Car can handle. For me in Alaska I do off road my trucks fairly hard, and if I didn’t I wouldn’t own a truck. For those of you who don’t off road articulation is at least as important as ground clearance. The problem with air is that when you increase the height you increase the spring rate therefore decreasing articulation. Which is the opposite of what you want off roading. Most People that off road newer Jeep GCs pull the air suspension for springs or never put it in high position.
I've owned a Wrangler for 20 years and have done a lot of off roading in CA, OR and WA. I have found that articulation is important sometimes, so is ground clearance. The third issue is tire traction, which is a combination of individual tire control and tire design. I ended up raising my jeep, putting quick disconnects on my anti-sway bar connecters and getting lockers. Having hung up my jeep, I'll give up some articulation for clearance, but above all I'd want 4 wheel control. I'll take 1 tire swinging in the wind if I have control of the other 3. But getting the tires stuck in the mud or high centered, well... I'm f**ckd. I'm looking forward to getting full 4 wheel control and great ground clearance.
 
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