[Cactus]

Surely Rivian must know that announcing a ~20% increase for pre-order reservation holders would result in mass mutiny.
Trying to re-think this. Maybe Rivian did this intentionally, realizing they could not fulfill current pre-orders for 2-3 years. So, if ~50% of pre-order holders cancel, they could fulfill pre-orders within 18 months and make quotas?... Just trying to understand Rivian's customer-unfriendly behaviour.

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

I agree. RJ and crew like to spew b.s. about how they’re different, but they‘re not. The push to IPO so soon instead of focusing on customers/product demonstrates this, imo. We’ve been worried and speculating for a while that their ramp is not consistent with their expressed timeline…. so a massive price hike gets them maximum money per unit for the few they will make and helps clear the order backlog for all the units people had wanted but Rivian wasn't actually going to deliver in any reasonable time.

i’m convinced Rivian doesn’t actually want to (possibly because they can’t) deliver at scale, for the next few years.

 

[jmk5151]

They had to get a huge infusion of cash with the IPO, plus at the rate they're going, I don't think the 20% increase is really going to impact their bottom line as they are making so few vehicles to begin with. Even if they get 10,000 out this year, which seems like a stretch, at a $15k increase, that's "only" $150 million?

The only things that make sense is the vehicles were priced low to begin with relative to the market, and they are such a small player they couldn't/didn't hedge properly and they don't have any leverage over materials and suppliers?

 

[Cactus]

I am old enough (barely) to remember when Honda, Toyota and Datsun (now Nissan) entered the US market. Their cars were less expensive, got better mileage, and were mechanically better (or at least as good) than the big 3 at the time. They must have operated on very thin margins or even lost money to GAIN MARKETSHARE in the US. Now look at them. Their strategy worked. I'm not sure Rivian's strategy of pissing off early adopters who are probably also shareholders (and evangelistic for Rivian) is going to work. They should have learned from history. Tesla's first car was sold in 2008 and they lost money until recently. Teslas aren't cheap, but the point is Musk did what it took to establish his company. This ~20% price increase was a poor decision.

 

[Cactus]

The other thing to consider is that, unlike Tesla, Rivian doesn't have its own charging network that was FREE to early Model S owners–and still is if you own a 2012-2016 model S.
Rivian must use crappy EA charging system which–when it works–is more expensive than gas. But I guess that doesn't matter if you paid >$90K for your vehicle (not including tax).
I wish yesterday was April 1 instead of March 1.

 

[MXA121]

Yes they know. Someone has already estimated the fallout and it likely won't matter in a years time. We can all agree that their pricing was "too good to be true" when compared to a Lightning.
I remember when Tesla just straight up canceled the standard range Model Y with its low initial price, which thousands had pre ordered and waited on. It sucks, and I'm mad too.

 

[BlackH20]

Surely Rivian must know that announcing a ~20% increase for pre-order reservation holders would result in mass mutiny.
Trying to re-think this. Maybe Rivian did this intentionally, realizing they could not fulfill current pre-orders for 2-3 years. So, if ~50% of pre-order holders cancel, they could fulfill pre-orders within 18 months and make quotas?... Just trying to understand Rivian's customer-unfriendly behavior.

They think they can maneuver around next week's earnings call. The stock drop will take their profit when or if they ever deliver a vehicle to a real customer in any volume. CEO should have stepped up and written a hard copy letter to every reservation, not some half-ass letter from customer service telling you to go check the build sheet you have been sitting on for a few year Rivian could have stated that current reservations are going to have a 10% price increase and are locked at that price, what they did is say all you 50K people are screwed as just as valuable is the person that doesn't know what a Rivian is. They can get the same price you did, we really don't care. They won't come back from this, surely not with my $100K. I can go plant a lot of trees for a $20K Rivian or Rip-Offian!

 

[O. horridus]

This page has a link to watch the earnings call on 3/10/22:

Investor Relations - Rivian

Rivian is an electric vehicle manufacturer on a mission to keep the world adventurous forever.

rivian.com

I don't know if they will allow participation ...

And here's the link directly, in case it gets taken down:

https://edge.media-server.com/mmc/p/axwnsoak

 

[RivianDoc]

I am old enough (barely) to remember when Honda, Toyota and Datsun (now Nissan) entered the US market. Their cars were less expensive, got better mileage, and were mechanically better (or at least as good) than the big 3 at the time. They must have operated on very thin margins or even lost money to GAIN MARKETSHARE in the US. Now look at them. Their strategy worked. I'm not sure Rivian's strategy of pissing off early adopters who are probably also shareholders (and evangelistic for Rivian) is going to work. They should have learned from history. Tesla's first car was sold in 2008 and they lost money until recently. Teslas aren't cheap, but the point is Musk did what it took to establish his company. This ~20% price increase was a poor decision.

My sentiments exactly!

 

[Cactus]

I always try to look at things from another perspective. I pre-ordered an R1S in Sept 2019. Maybe Rivian is thinking, 'where else can people get a large-ish EV SUV with the (luxury) features that Rivian has that can go offroad and drive with manners on the highway? Answer: nowhere! So, we can raise prices as high as we want. Where are people going to go?'

We have no alternatives, so R1S reservation holders are at Rivian's mercy.

It's a little different for R1T reservation holders bc the F150 lightning is pretty close and the Silverado is not far behind the F150 EV truck. And who knows what will happen with the cybertruck.

But the way they suddenly increased prices on things that were included doesn't build good will and loyalty to the Rivian brand. So maybe Rivian thinks: 'Who cares? if we are the frying pan, Ford, GM and Stellantis are the fire.

Bottom line: customer is always..... screwed.

 

[Huh?]

I always try to look at things from another perspective. I pre-ordered an R1S in Sept 2019. Maybe Rivian is thinking, 'where else can people get a large-ish EV SUV with the (luxury) features that Rivian has that can go offroad and drive with manners on the highway? Answer: nowhere! So, we can raise prices as high as we want. Where are people going to go?'

We have no alternatives, so R1S reservation holders are at Rivian's mercy.

This. I had not canceled my RS1 pre-order in response to the hikes. Yesterday, I spent some time on Volvo and BMW's sites as XC90, X5, and X7 were my original alternatives to ordering the RS1. The prices on the hybrid XC90 and X5 were lower than the new RS1 price while the X7 was comparable. But when factoring all the things about the RS1 that I love (styling, full electric, off-road capabilities, 7 seats, etc.), it wasn't much of a choice...there is no true competitor to the RS1 on the market or close to market AFAIK. I was going to keep my preorder and pay the increased prices. But I am quite happy today to have the original pricing reinstated.

 

[Coltsneckbob]

Surely Rivian must know that announcing a ~20% increase for pre-order reservation holders would result in mass mutiny.
Trying to re-think this. Maybe Rivian did this intentionally, realizing they could not fulfill current pre-orders for 2-3 years. So, if ~50% of pre-order holders cancel, they could fulfill pre-orders within 18 months and make quotas?... Just trying to understand Rivian's customer-unfriendly behaviour.

I follow your logic, but to do that leaves a bad taste in everyone's mouth and I think it shows really bad governance of the executives. Do they really know how to run a car company and sell cars? Sure they reversed, but still points to a lack of good judgement and understanding of the market they are in.